This came up in another thread, so I thought I'd start a separate thread to ask this question for everyone to see and comment on:

The one component of the game that ruins the game experience most often are specials. In particular with more and more specials being completely OP and that mean an instant 'game over' when they turn up. As said in the other thread, I often don't even use them when they pop up on my side IF my attack plan is on track as they are boring (other than the cool visuals for some of them). I honestly think the game would be much better off without them....

....thoughts?

Having to account for the possibility of a special makes things more complex and interesting, so I am certainly not in favour of removing them.

Having said that: I also am no fan of completely OP specials like that of Thalassa and to some extend of Ingenica, Ixofex, Elvira, Necromancer and others. When the generals were released they were among the best monsters, but with the exception of Shannara and Alces their specials are crap. Which made them more balanced. It would be nice to see some more balance with the current release of monsters as well.

@David-ML Really I feel like the idea of special are fine, but other factos like hardened, and extra turn skills. Make way more commonly appearing then they should. I feel like they should be removed from war completely, but everywhere else in the game they stay put.

I agree with @Ekto-Gamat on that Specials make the game very interesting, and it'd be nice to keep them around. However, that said, I also feel that some things need to be addressed in some situations:

1. Back to back specials, particularly from the same monster- This needs to be stopped in all aspects of the game, especially wars. A special once a match is, acceptable (unless its an instant death one, or an OP one like Thalassa's), but please, work needs to be done to prevent them from repeatedly triggering. The other specials that @Ekto-Gamat mentioned, namely Necromancer's, Ixofex's etc. are something that can be usually dealt with, in the course of a match, unless they come up at a particularly clutch moment. (But then, we might as well ask for stopping the strange, and sometimes unexplained misses too).
2. Special Survival Dungeons- Specials need to be TOTALLY disabled for these, imo (for both sides in interest of fairness). These often contain unique imposed conditions like Cooldowns Activated, and if a special pops up at the beginning of a match, particularly for a monster with strength runes, its an instant game over. Now, people might argue that everybody is at liberty to continue with other monsters, but there's no gurantee that the same episode will not be repeated again, and since this can keep happening even to those with a sizeable selection of eligible monsters, I feel its in the best interest of the whole playerbase to remove them altogether from these dungeons.

Sorry David - Specials add spice, and chance.

Mind you, specials like Thalassa's shouldn't be in the game.

@C0ntr1v3d Spice and chance to a degree is fine, but there are so many 'game over' specials in the game now that it is becoming more like a throw of a dice in too many battles

I think we should be talking about less destructive solutions. I don't like the idea of removing the specials (because I love the design behind them) but I also don't like specials condemning the whole fight. Balancing. That's what we need.

Having specials is cool and all, but is really frustrating going into a match on a war or pvp where the fisrt move of 1 or sometimes 2 enemy monsters are the special move, I haven't seen the 3 doing it back to back, but 2 for sure, kind of the same that is happenning to me every time I land CDA, I know for sure at least 1or 2 specials are coming my way.

@esentis said in Specials - better off without them?:

I think we should be talking about less destructive solutions.

I think we all agree that going into a fight to get annihilated on the first or second move is the most frustrating. So one possibility of reducing the impact of specials is to scale the chance of occurrence with the duration of the fight. It could be something like a 1% increase per turn of a monster starting with 0% on the first turn until it hits the 5% on the 6th turn. This means as the fight progresses, so does the chance of specials coming up...

.... thoughts?

@David-ML Or maybe Specials should have a diminishing returns. Meaning that when a special is occurred (with 5% chance) the whole team's special chance would drop to 0% and will start increasing 1% each turn (only when the special is casted, so you avoid stacking specials) as you suggested. Boy I got destroyed so many times in survival dungeons from back to back specials I almost smashed my phone on the wall ^^

Specials are fine with me IF they do have a 5% chance. They can be blocked by freezing, stunning, total blinding, and a good player will play the game of probabilities there and account for the fact that a special may hit.

But anything over 5% makes the game too dependent on luck.

I think we have much, much more pressing issues with the game.

@David-ML said in Specials - better off without them?:

@esentis said in Specials - better off without them?:

I think we should be talking about less destructive solutions.

I think we all agree that going into a fight to get annihilated on the first or second move is the most frustrating. So one possibility of reducing the impact of specials is to scale the chance of occurrence with the duration of the fight. It could be something like a 1% increase per turn of a monster starting with 0% on the first turn until it hits the 5% on the 6th turn. This means as the fight progresses, so does the chance of specials coming up...

.... thoughts?

In most fights, monsters will have only 1 or 2 turns. At least when high level runes are in play. That concept would be fine if fights lasted a bit longer.

Please reduce the chance of specials. It is almost impossible to have a fight without at least one, many times 3 or more. They affect too much the strategy. It is not good for the game at all

@david-ml said in Specials - better off without them?:

I think we all agree that going into a fight to get annihilated on the first or second move is the most frustrating. So one possibility of reducing the impact of specials is to scale the chance of occurrence with the duration of the fight. It could be something like a 1% increase per turn of a monster starting with 0% on the first turn until it hits the 5% on the 6th turn. This means as the fight progresses, so does the chance of specials coming up...

With the Nemesis Dungeon bringing up the frustrations of multiple specials (special fest - yay) on starting fights, I thought I should resurrect this thread again. I think the above idea would work nicely and maybe reset the chance of specials occurring after it has triggered back to 0% for that monster. Whilst not eliminating specials, they would not happen on first turn. If you think the chance increase is to small, then maybe 0% > 2% > 4% > 5%

@david-ml said in Specials - better off without them?:

@david-ml said in Specials - better off without them?:

I think we all agree that going into a fight to get annihilated on the first or second move is the most frustrating. So one possibility of reducing the impact of specials is to scale the chance of occurrence with the duration of the fight. It could be something like a 1% increase per turn of a monster starting with 0% on the first turn until it hits the 5% on the 6th turn. This means as the fight progresses, so does the chance of specials coming up...

With the Nemesis Dungeon bringing up the frustrations of multiple specials (special fest - yay) on starting fights, I thought I should resurrect this thread again.

No-no, just no!

And yes, I also got wiped out by mutltiple specials near the end of the Nemesis Dungeon. I need the frustration in order to enjoy it fullest when something doesn't go wrong.

@ekto-gamat said in Specials - better off without them?:

No-no, just no!

Touchee

@ekto-gamat said in Specials - better off without them?:

I need the frustration in order to enjoy it fullest when something doesn't go wrong.

Yes indeed, you can only appreciate the glorious moments to its fullest if you know the deepest abyss of despair. However, I don't have to revisit the abyss on a regular basis

Anything would be better than it is now. If the AI gets a turn there’s a 75% chance you’re getting hit with a special now.

@testcyp Yeah 3/5 Fights EVERY war has ultimates involved from the ai, and 1/5 of those are always more then 1 from the ai. It is some gold old bs.

Unless I am blessed by a repetitive RNG, I am tempted to agree that it seems that the chance of special occurring has been increased. It definitely feels more like 10% (1 in 10 turns) than 5% (1 in 20 turns) now. With the amount of battle deciding specials in the game these days, it makes battles more often like a roll of dice rather than a tactical win. Maybe SP should introduce a 'battle chest' at the beginning of the battle you are presented with a chest, click on it to find out whether you have won

@david-ml brilliant

Again as I have said in previous posts very strange coincidence that just before the metal warmaster was released the ultimates seemed to increase tenfold oh and what does this warmaster do that’s right blocks all ultimates to team just strange coincidence I suppose.

@callumarachnoid you keep on confusing special damage with 'specials'. The metal WM does not protect you from any specials except for the inflicted damage if it is special and not elemental damage

Seems like specials were happening way less for a brief period (not complaining, felt like proper 5%ish). Now over last few days noticing them coming up quite often. Has anyone else noticed this?

@star-parts i haven't noticed anything. I saw 1 special in Nemesis dungeon and it was on a long fight. I've had 2 in the last 2 wars. So maybe you got bad luck, or I have had good luck

@testcyp ok thats good news

@testcyp, there has been a lot of Nature Element requirements in Dungeons & Wars lately & I haven't seen Prince Charmless's Special come up in over 2 weeks! I am rarely seeing Specials from any monster at all....

Same, the new percentage chance has definitely been a blessing for battles and whilst I do have the odd special here or there, most battles are now decided by tactics rather than which side gets the most specials! Only the odd series of misses are bothersome at times.....

Anyone else noticing it yet or do i still just have bad luck?

Edit: non-stop specials all weekend

Again, non-stop all weekend. Just got hit with 4 in last two matches.

At this point, i wouldnt miss them if they went away all together.

Just had standoff with francine frank where my confuse missed her about seven times (without neg accuracy effects) until she got special and my team was wiped from her 3-turn death.

Yeah I dislike specials since they make the battle luck based