So guys, i was pretty hyped because i like these races, but it seems like SP have put a lot more of the epic breeding quests back in, unlike last race.
Looks like SP werent getting enough gems out of us last race :)

@Lassem Highly disappointed in SP over this, I thought they had learned a lesson, guess not. Last race was much better but in the 2nd lap we get "First member to breed 7 Epic monsters" quest, please fork over 110 gems to continue........

Yeah man. We are on lap 4 right now and already had 4-5 quests involving epic breeding, whester solo or joint effort, still must be gemmed :x

It's almost as if SP is TRYING to take the fun out of the game. Our team is once again stuck in an unwinnable group, so matchmaking didn't get fixed. Even so, we would have enjoyed competing with the same tasks as last race - but, no, it's back to being only for spenders. The community gave them so many ideas and options to make it better for everyone, and what did they do? Revert it back to the way that NO ONE BUT BIG SPENDERS WANT.

Edit: please watch your language per forum rules.

@Lassem I agree with you guys, there should be no epic or legend breeding in the races, neither team or solo. But these races are nothing but gems hoggers no matter how you slice it.

@Nynaevelan said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Lassem I agree with you guys, there should be no epic or legend breeding in the races, neither team or solo. But these races are nothing but gems hoggers no matter how you slice it.

Btw how is your team group ? are you into it ? it is your name on it ;)

Well it earns a lot of money from people in top teams like BOA who reached 118 laps or los cracks who reached 120 laps. imaging how much people spend to get that amount of laps, probably a ton. SP earns a ton from using gems to skip nodes, so they will never remove quests like epic breeding and we will probably be seeing more epic breeding in more races and probably legendary breeding.

How are people ever gonna get fairness in the races, everyone wants the monster as well, you can't just have teams go up against spenders, how are we supposed to win or even want to try to win? I just honestly find it unfair for f2players (like myself) since gems are scarce resources and no way i'll be spending it on a monster that isn't as good as what a 249 gems monster bring. I want to collect the monster but SP just keeps making things harder and harder

but what i'd really love to see (but SP would only do this if they actually care about the players and not just money) is a team race where you can't spend gems, and stupid rules such as epic breeding is removed.

Our team has only 10 members (out of 30) of level 60 or higher, and 3 more members between 50 and 60.
We are matched with a team that has only one member under level 70 and 29 members with higher level.

How is that fair in any way?

Well I guess I was lucky enough to join a good team and now we are on 14th lap. But spenders don't do all the job. I already have reached 5m food in individual rewards but only spent gems for things such as farming and rune crafting.

What do I need to breed an epic the quickest?

I have Firesaur and Pegasus, which gives either Greenasaur (UC) or Pandaken (R) in 30 seconds, so that is awesome for individual rewards, but for an Epic I would be stumped.

Tarzape + Thundenix gives Dragonian Beast (2hours)...but Rhynex, Rabidex & Griffex (Griffin?) are in the mix too...

@ss13 Oh thanks, but I don't have either of them anymore. :(

@Clackers tarzape= Treezard + Rockilla; Thundenix = Thunder eagle + Firesaur...Thundenix is the longer breed (2 hours, I think)...

The Epic breeding nodes were/are much earlier in the race than previous ones this time it seemed.

May just have been completely random, or it was designed to pose an early road block against F2P and paying teams.

@MarshallTheBeef Well I have already got 4.1m food rewards from this event - but my team doesn't bother playing, so we haven't even completed a lap yet :o

I'll start off by saying that I too very much dislike all these epic breeding quests! Seems like every lap starting with the 2nd one has had at least 1 quest involving breeding epics. And let's be honest, the only way to pass those is by spending gems.
Either you pay the quest cost, or you gamble breeding and hatching over and over again (not recommended).

That being said, I'd like to shine some light on why the race isn't as "bad" as it's constantly portrayed to be...at least for the winning team

In order to get a rank 3 monster, you need 640 cells + a copy of a monster.
Thus you would need 7 copies of a monster you want to get to rank 3.

In terms of food you would need a total of 16,486,340 food to get 1 monster to rank 3.
(~2.2mil food * 6 monsters you'll feed to lv 100 to extract)
(3,559,020 food needed to level up a monster all the way to 115)

Now assuming a monster goes on sale for 249 gems, you would have to spend 1,743 gems to purchase that monster.
(249* 7 copies of the monster you need)

And how about all that hatchery time and extracting time (more gems if you want to rent extra pods).

So, for just 1 player to get a rank 3 monster, the player would need:
1,743 gems.
16.5 million food.
~ 1 week of hatching/extracting

If you win the race, your WHOLE team gets a rank 3, plus a legendary monster, plus 60 elementium, plus all those wonderful individual rewards.
If as a team you collectively spent less than 52,470 gems (1,749*30), then you got a really amazing deal!

Now of course there are those team that spend a lot 100+ laps, but I imagine those teams are in the minority, whereas the teams that win with 20-30 laps or less are in the majority.

Furthermore, a team can just not participate in the race. Just get their 4 laps in and enjoy their free legendary monster, 5 elemetium, and 500k food. I think they get individual rewards too, up tp 5 mil food?

I think what they should do is to just take out all epic breeding tasks (other than maybe the 4 members must breed one epic) and just say one member must spend 100 gems and all members must contribute as much as they can to spend 120 gems (in 10 gem increments).

That way there is no pretense that they are presenting us with an actually achievable tasks. Basically just call it what it is!!!

Alternatively, they could reduce epic breeding time during the race to 6 hours or something like that. At least you can then work on some epic ranking at the same time and get something else out of it!

They way it is now is just dishonest and stupid!!!

@David-ML Agreed. I haven't seen the PvP tasks... must've swapped them out for epic breeds...epic harrumph! I'll settle for Erebus, thank you.

Hello everyone,

tasks in TR are rebalanced after every TR. If it's there this race it doesn't necessarily mean that it will be there for next.
I hear you and forwarded the feedback and they will take it into consideration when they will prepare balancing for the next one.

I've also seen a concern, how can weaker teams compete with the top. As you know we will be launching a new PVP which will introduce leagues in the game and maybe we can take some learnings from it and it could be a good test if leagues would work for TR as well. Therefore, when you will be abe to play the new pvp we will need a lot of feedback from you guys. What do you think about this option?

@David-ML also had a good suggestion that we will make sure to pass on. Anything that could help you guys that is in reasonable measures, please feel free to let us know!

@Fox Thanks for passing this on - much appreciated!

It is essentially impossible to breed 9 epics without spending more gems than what the payout is. Also, except for a small minority, the vast majority of teams consist of a mixture of F2P, low spenders and maybe a handful or so of regular spenders. I understand that SP wants to make players pay gems to advance as this is the currency of the game, however, making single tasks cost 140 gems prevents a large portion of team members to contribute. If gem payouts is what SP wants, then make them smaller so that weight of the contributions can be spread more evenly throughout teams....

....and I am looking forward to the new PvP league system. Sounds promising and will hopefully spice up the game again! And yes, it may provide a key for solving some of the TR and TW issues.

If SP makes a League system for Team Races, they will undoubtedly also lower the prizes for the lower tiers. Which of course will make people very angry again.

Even though I fully agree about the absurdity of the epic breeding 'tasks' (aka 'we need one volunteer to gem this'), I am continuously surprised that some people just don't grasp that only 1 in 20 teams is supposed to get the lvl 115 monster and that it is supposed to be expensive. If you don't want to compete with the heavy spending teams you are not supposed to get it.

@Fox I'm actually looking forward to the PvP leagues! Fed up of team races & team wars shenanigans...but I like the look of the PvP leagues 😀

The simple solution to the Epic breed problem is by making more Epic breeds available that are a low timer (permanently). Make some of the old, weak Epics have a high chance at a 2 hour breed.

What's the worst that will happen - people get more 120 Epics like they are supposed to? More cells get donated?

I honestly prefer the PVP attacks over the Epic breeds. At least the PVP attacks someone can pay 5 gems an attack for and get some reward out of what they spent..

@Ekto-Gamat said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

If SP makes a League system for Team Races, they will undoubtedly also lower the prizes for the lower tiers. Which of course will P people off again.

Even though I fully agree about the absurdity of the epic breeding 'tasks' (aka 'we need one volunteer to gem this'), I am continuously surprised that some people just don't grasp that only 1 in 20 teams is supposed to get the lvl 115 monster and that it is supposed to be expensive. If you don't want to compete with the heavy spending teams you are not supposed to get it.

I don't think it is some don't grasp it. It is a matter to win even 11th place someone has to breed all those Epics and there are team members that just don't want to spend the gems and a small handful spend gems. "Team" is the word here and how many really have enough to continually throw at popping out those Epics. Not only that but this TR was started in the middle of the Summer Breeding Even't level 3 where half the people already had their nests full of monsters.

Epic breeding/hatching times are ridiculous even if you are using your guardian.

I could care less about a so so monster, but I do like a bit of team work and a goal to work towards something. But nothing has really been done about jumping teams and starting new teams. And making teams compete against heavy spending teams when a team is a low level is just plain silly. They have a way to figure out which teams will spend a bunch or which teams are joining new teams.

Figure out how to balance it out and make some money and everyone will be happy. If it cost 10 gems to skip something maybe everyone would contribute or better yet, as suggested previously lay it out. You are going to need to spend x amount of gems if you want to participate.

@Ekto-Gamat said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

If SP makes a League system for Team Races, they will undoubtedly also lower the prizes for the lower tiers. Which of course will P people off again.

You are skating close to the edge here, let's avoid this to avoid editing and/or banning issues.

I did the math. Tarzape + Thundenix gives almost one epic per day without guardian (because of the 10% chance to get Dragonian Beast with 2h breed time), so with 2 Tarzape/Thundenix combos and guardian you will breed 9-10 epic monsters a day. The problem of course is to hatch them.

If a player prepares for this, he will have two epic monsters ready to hatch for the start of the lap, so he has to breed 7 more. Depending on the depth of your pocket you can breed just a few of them and close the gap with diamonds.

@Giorgos-Kossi

I assume teams in a race get the same tasks. I actually sent a bug report and got the reply that team races are set up completely at random. So any new team could be matched with a top team.

I certainly would like to see a change here. We know that we don't even have to try after looking at the top 3 teams, we can probably end up in the top 10 and get Virtue, finishing at position 8-9 with 7 laps or so.

@Frunobulax Your calculations are based on if you get Dragonian Beast each time. In that mix is Rabidex and Rhynex which have a day and a half breeding times, so the chance is 10% but I have noticed during these events it seems lower. Maybe it isn't but getting a DB seems to be lower during these events.

@Haka-Taka said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Nynaevelan said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Lassem I agree with you guys, there should be no epic or legend breeding in the races, neither team or solo. But these races are nothing but gems hoggers no matter how you slice it.

Btw how is your team group ? are you into it ? it is your name on it ;)

Unfortunately we are paired with three super teams, so we are in 4th place. We could probably make an effort to try to catch and pass #2 but #1 is so far ahead, on lap 25 at last check, that we decided we are not going to throw away a lot of gems just to end up in the second spot. I will just have to buy him later (insert very sad face).

@Suzznee

@Suzznee said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Ekto-Gamat said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

If SP makes a League system for Team Races, they will undoubtedly also lower the prizes for the lower tiers. Which of course will make people very angry again.

Even though I fully agree about the absurdity of the epic breeding 'tasks' (aka 'we need one volunteer to gem this'), I am continuously surprised that some people just don't grasp that only 1 in 20 teams is supposed to get the lvl 115 monster and that it is supposed to be expensive. If you don't want to compete with the heavy spending teams you are not supposed to get it.

I don't think it is some don't grasp it. It is a matter to win even 11th place someone has to breed all those Epics and there are team members that just don't want to spend the gems and a small handful spend gems. "Team" is the word here and how many really have enough to continually throw at popping out those Epics. Not only that but this TR was started in the middle of the Summer Breeding Even't level 3 where half the people already had their nests full of monsters.

Oh yes, I completely agree with that part. :)

My slightly off topic response sprang forth from the suggestion of Race brackets in tiers.

@Suzznee
Nope. You have 10% DB, 23.5% other epics, 6.75% for Bonbon (2h), 15.75% for Electrex (1h) and 45% for a breeding time of 6 minutes or less.
See Wiki

If you sort it out, you end up with roughly 0.95 epics per day. Essentially, DB is almost half as likely as the other epics, and this yields an average breeding time of just under a day for any epic. If you take the non-epic monsters into account, the average drops to less than 1 per day.

@Nynaevelan
In our race, 1st position has 11 laps and a comfortable distance to #2 at 8 laps. I guess they'll stop spending until their position is challenged.

@Frunobulax said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Suzznee
Nope. You have 10% DB, 23.5% other epics, 6.75% for Bonbon (2h), 15.75% for Electrex (1h) and 45% for a breeding time of 6 minutes or less.
See Wiki

If you sort it out, you end up with roughly 0.95 epics per day. Essentially, DB is almost half as likely as the other epics, and this yields an average breeding time of just under a day for any epic. If you take the non-epic monsters into account, the average drops to less than 1 per day.

Great by theory, but fails in execution. While the team is breeding maybe one epic a day, other teams are just buying out and passing you because the Epic breed nodes are just ridiculous.

maybe they could change "breeding epics" to "collect breeding points". as in the 72h challenge you get points for time+rarity. maybe that could make a difference if you collect breeding points as a team. and you could mix in the legendary breeding

@MarshallTheBeef
Actually, it's a calculation so it can't really succeed or fail :) It just says you need 1 day to complete such a task with pure breeding. So without diamonds a team may manage 6 laps, maybe 7.

BTW, many teams want to race without spending diamonds. We for example are currently #5. #3 is out of reach, #10 is two rounds back, so why spend any diamonds?

Just another argument of why team races should be more balanced. If we weren't in a race with a few whale teams, I'm sure we 'd spend more to reach #3 at least.

@Frunobulax said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@MarshallTheBeef
Actually, it's a calculation so it can't really succeed or fail :) It just says you need 1 day to complete such a task with pure breeding. So without diamonds a team may manage 6 laps, maybe 7.

BTW, many teams want to race without spending diamonds. We for example are currently #5. #3 is out of reach, #10 is two rounds back, so why spend any diamonds?

Just another argument of why team races should be more balanced. If we weren't in a race with a few whale teams, I'm sure we 'd spend more to reach #3 at least.

Fair - sorry I was just venting ;)

The amount of epic breeding in this Team Race is absolutely ridiculous. Has everyone been getting a node with Epic breeding every 3 or 4 nodes..?

@Lassem It is really bad, Our team had to buy out epic breeding quests at about 1 per lap and twice on the last lap to qualify. Essentially two of us had to waste 250 gems each so that the rest of the team could get a monster that we ddn't really want. We just wanted to make sure and qualify so our team members didn't all abandon us. I hate team races. I wish they were not part of the game and they bring nothing "fun" to the game when you can't even qualify without spending gems....

Nobody will get the last place monster rewards as only the top 10 will even make 4 laps...go figure.

@Clackers you need to switch teams lol

@David-ML I agree it does cost gems. In anticipation of event, during happy hour I went on, what I call, an app bend got over 3,000 gems installing apps I deleted after gems were collected so not too much of a hard ship.

@Jordan-Tan in anticipation of this event during happy hour I went on an app bend, I got almost 3,000 gems to spend on race. So while yes it's a pain to do epics if your team planed ahead it's not such a struggle. Of course next race unless monsterwood updates offers we are goofed.

@Ginger-Vandenberg how did you get over 3,000 gems by installing? I don't even get more than 10 for installing/doing something to gain gems from monsterwood

@Jordan-Tan said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Ginger-Vandenberg how did you get over 3,000 gems by installing? I don't even get more than 10 for installing/doing something to gain gems from monsterwood

She didn't say she got them by installing, most likely she purchased a few packs.

It's OK to spend a few gems to get a ranked up top monster. However, it is completely unfair to semi-new players, who will never be in a position to join a top team. I did spend a reasonable sum of diamonds in this race, and we're currently at position 6. Great.

The thing is, it's not even sensible from a commercial standpoint. After 1 day we realized that we were up against some top teams, and from this time on it was clear that we only need to stay in the top 10. Why should we spend any more gems? Matchmaking for races should be implemented, this would both be good for team morale and for diamond spending.

we were the only team in our group to even do the race, we did 19 laps and 1 other team did I think 2 laps, the rest 0...Yet we had a ton of breed epic quest.

@Fox said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

tasks in TR are rebalanced after every TR. If it's there this race it doesn't necessarily mean that it will be there for next.
I hear you and forwarded the feedback and they will take it into consideration when they will prepare balancing for the next one.

My team speed war found it difficult to get through the epic breedings and I was wondering why there seemed to be no or few PVP tasks?

@Kaiju said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

@Fox said in Team Race [epic breeding]:

tasks in TR are rebalanced after every TR. If it's there this race it doesn't necessarily mean that it will be there for next.
I hear you and forwarded the feedback and they will take it into consideration when they will prepare balancing for the next one.

My team speed war found it difficult to get through the epic breedings and I was wondering why there seemed to be no or few PVP tasks?

I actually so NO PVP tasks this time and triple the number of Epic breedings. Why oh why do they throw in Epic breedings that are ridiculously long .. .Oh Wait! They want more money from us

@Suzznee lol you know in the next race we are going to be bombarded with a lot of pvp fights, something like one person has to do 15 or more. These things are a gem hog, they do not need to throw in these nodes with these impossible goals to get the gems spent.