SP has done a lot of work on improving the ai, lately. One of the benefits of a more predictable ai is that you can tweak monster's skills in such a way that they will do what you want them to do under certain circumstances. Unfortunately SP changes the ai's behaviour almost weekly, causing monsters to choose different skills than before. Skillsets that gave me the desired result at first can suddenly become useless on defence.
It's becoming extremely expensive to have to change skills, and test different skills set ups, every time there is a change! Please make changing skills available for gold, not gems. This way SP can keep tinkering with the ai as much as they want, without frustrating the players who try to set sensible defences.
For anyone who may be interested: I am providing a link (not live of course, imagine that :P, just add an 'h' in the URL) to pt. 2 of the History of Resurrection of AMAB. It was primarily written as a document for AMAB's players to look back to, but may interest players of other teams as well, since it obviously also deals a bit with ML history in general and other (mostly 'elite') teams are mentioned as well. It is mostly about wars, but also shows how game fatigue could creep in with many, leading to almost the entire lead team making place for a new lead team recently.
If you don't like it just move along, there's nothing to see here.
Rewards listed now are a joke. If you want teams to spend gems on an event like this you really should do better. Currently there are only 13 teams 'qualified' for tier 1, where you can get a diamond relic, the one thing that made this event worth spending on.
PainDa, Untamable, Vortigern, United Assassins, Prou!!, Australia Rocks, et cetera (tier 2 teams), really don't give a hoot about a chance of obtaining a golden relic chest. At least not when it comes at great expense. They get plenty of these things for free in Mazes and PVP rewards.
There is no carrot here, please reconsider.
Right ... OK ... normally I would say you have to pick the events you want to play, because you cannot do them all. However, in this case: both Battlegrounds and a Race are gem and time consuming team efforts. It's very difficult to do both well when they follow each other.
This is potentially very harmful for a team's cohesion. Some will want to play only one, and of course not the one the other half wants, others will want to play both, some will want to play none. SP, please space it. Battlegrounds instead of a Race, of which we already had an abundance anyway, would be perfect.
I also don't understand the logic behind these rewards. Players expect gems, similar to the rewards for all previous adventure map islands. For most players advanced enough to reach the final stage of the adventure map rewards like food, gold and lvl 5 runes are really meaningless.
Giving players a one time number of circa 35 gems for completing the adventure map is not going to structurally give them more free gems than is beneficial to SP. Not giving them gems only is a disappointment after waiting so long for a new chapter and will feed the tiresome 'SP is greedy' mantra more
TLDR: Please be nice to each other, we are all human beings who share a love for the game.
When I started playing this game on instigation of my wife I had no idea about where it would take me. I loved the game, and started doing well in challenges and PVP. When Team Wars was introduced I was lucky enough to be accepted in All Men are Brothers, which moved to Resurrection of AMAB two wars later.
What i liked about team wars, and AMAB in particular, is that it didn’t matter if you were a Vietnamese student, an Australian lawyer, a Danish Egyptian, a homosexual American or a Dutch Iraqi. We were bonded by our love for the game. We shared the same experiences in close wars, strategising, victories and defeats. Over time, as my position of co-lead also required, I became acquainted with many players and leads from other teams as well. Some I became friends with, others I at least respected. A few I did not like, but that is normal. Even though I always considered the official Forum as the primary place for a sane discussion, I was a member of many Facebook groups on Monster Legends as well. Of course there was enough drama there over the years, but nothing that really shook my belief in my fellow gamers as in general reasonable and kind people.
Over the past week however, I have seen so much nastiness on Facebook that I decided to leave all those groups and only stay here (for now). The most vile and depressing dark sides of human nature come to the surface at an increasingly alarming rate on Facebook and, from what I heard, also on Discord:
- Personal Attacks of any nature
- Downright Bullying
- Exploitation of Glitches and trying to make that sound OK
- Sexual predatory behaviour
- Utmost disrespect from elite teams towards each other
- Mental abuse
- Power abuse
- Abuse of trust
- Playing own judge
- Greed, Jealousy and Selfishness
All of this does not come from teenagers, but from adults with children and sometimes even grandchildren.
Of course there still are many great people in this game. I still consider most ex AMAB players my friends and good acquaintances. I speak daily to my friends in Untamable. I still have many friends in other teams. I also however, have been disappointed by too many people lately that I respected.
So I am out. I would not recommend anyone to join any Monster Legends resource other than this Forum.
And if you do frequent other groups: please play nice.
I would not be complaining about something that has not been released yet, It surprises me SP has not adopted something like this earlier. If SP is smart they will make this low threshold. Ten thousands of players paying 3 dollars a month is more valuable then a few hundred paying 20. I would not mind having a low cost monthly 'premium subscription fee' to get some benefits.
If this turns out to be a 50 dollars minimum monthly thing then by all means jump the barricades.
Just would like to add that much of this malcontent seems to spring from a fundamentally wrong approach in how SP introduces things in the game. Very little thought for long term consequences. Once SP realises something may be wrong they try to adjust in such a way that it makes the community unhappy, regardless of the wisdom of this adjustment.
Only a few examples:
No more elementium frats: Probably a good decision, but makes people unhappy (and created imbalance)
No more generals for 800 coins: Probably not a good decision and made people unhappy (and created imbalance)
No more lvl IX runes in the shop: not sure about this one, but certainly made people unhappy (and created imbalance)
Nerfing Thorder: Excellent decision, made people unhappy, but at least this was before the Lab.
Of course this is still better than some things that did not get fixed, like the early war coin glitch three years ago, giving people hundreds of thousands of war coins. Created a massive imbalance which still can be felt today.
SP has always worked like this. Acting rashly and bringing on (sometimes necessary) changes to clean up what went wrong. Latest example is the release of a completely OP denier like Thalassa. It's very unfortunate, but if I wanted to leave the game because of this I would have done so three years ago. SP has been improving much with their communication, if they are generous enough with any 'compensations' now this will probably all blow over.
I like the changes, because I think chain denial is stupid and only for beginning players or advanced players with little imagination.
Not exactly directly related to the changes, but I am absolutely loving being able to change skills for gold. This introduces a nice addition in strategy to plan for particular wars, and monster interaction. I wonder if SP could consider making this change permanent. The only players who ever change skills for gems regularly are players in elite teams anyway (or who could play there if they wanted).
Rune removal discount for 2 weeks is nice, but gems are still gems. Giving a Xiron a complete rune overhaul could cost as much as 108 gems (taking off 6 X runes for 18 gems)
Thalassa is the denier who is least affected by all of this, but yet players can only get a refund for her. A refund in orbs which they will probably spend on another Thalassa because they can keep the dungeon and blessing rewards.
In the meantime players with monsters that are affected much more, like Brontes, remain without any compensation.
Thing is tho like the timing of the event smart business, people r using gems to try skip the big epic nodes in races.
So your reasoning is that when there is a race there should be no other events that require gems? Not everyone is obsessed by racing, you know.
If you are F2P you have to make choices. If you choose to dump hundreds of in-game-earned gems into a race then do not be angry if you cannot complete another event.
Before I start some whining of my own: congratulations ML on your fourth (mobile) birthday!
There are a few things about the Yntec Dungeons and Progressive Relics Island that bother me, however. In my view a birthday event is an ideal opportunity to create goodwill among the gaming community. Be generous and kind. Make everyone happy. Happy people are spending people. Not so much this time.
The Candles. They were hard to get for lvl 100+ players, because you hid some of them in a 72 hours challenge that is nearly unplayable for them. While lower level players could go several rounds without any problems, higher level players would struggle to get Muerte and Yndra and miss out on candles. This is not fair to the long time players who have helped shaping this game over the years, among whom many F2P who cannot afford to buy themselves into the event. Putting candles in Monsterwood was a good move, but without quite some luck there would still be missing candles.
Yntec needed to be crafted and hatched. In total this costs another 4 days, so approximately 100 gems to speed it up if you didn't get enough cells in time. That's a high entrance fee for a birthday party. Putting Yntec cells in Monsterwood is nice, but a little late. If you want to bother playing the relics event you don't want to start 2 days before the end, so speeding up required.
If this was a regular event, I would completely understand the mechanics behind all this: relics are valuable, so if you want a chance at getting them you need to invest time and gems. But this is a birthday event, and therefore everyone should feel a part of the party. Not feel frustrated because they are standing outside in the cold or have to pay to get in.
I think extending the relics progressive island with 2 days (so SP would chip in on the hatching and crafting time of Yntec) would create quite some goodwill again.
I see some people are, not surprisingly, completely missing the point of the opening post.
If you think the price for a monster on sale is 'normal', then it also is 'normal' if the price of the race monster is lower than that if you divide the cost equally among each team member. It hardly matters if there is an increase in costs compared to previous races or not. Every team can decide for themselves if the race monster is worth the effort to get cheaper than you would when buying it on sale.
I am quite sure well organized teams specialized in racing can still get the monster much cheaper, though of course I would love to see some actual gem counts from teams who are actively participating, as Haka asked. Teams who want to play the game instead of doing mind-numbingly stupid race tasks every 2 weeks, or who cannot coordinate dividing the tasks well enough, should probably just skip it.
So my Theory is that tbg will be more frequently in future when all bugs are out and its no longer beta, I personally like that so winnings should be more balanced. but if thats the idea the recovery of monsters should be like in war or to make it slightly harder like survival dungeon also for the attack side. The gem price for recovery is still way to high
Exactly this. If SP is afraid diamond relics will become too easily available, then fine, lower the rewards. But also make it (far) more easy-to-play.
There is no Warmaster problem other than the OP-ness of Thalassa.
Elvira is not OP, she just shook the foundations of regular turn order and she increased the value of buff stripping monsters.
Yes, Warmasters are available to 'all', which is a very good thing compared to the previous 'cash only' VIPs and Nemeses. So now everyone can play with the new game mechanics, instead of just the whales and moderate spenders. Rank 0 warmasters still struggle against rank 3+ regular monsters.
Without spending it will still take a ridiculous amount of time to rank them to 5, 4 or even 3 stars, leaving both the long term goals and the advantage of paying players intact.
Get a deny and put speed runes on it.
Get a support and put team speed runes on it (with maybe a life rune if its life is rubbish)
Get a attacker and put strength runes on it.
Do this about 1000 times for every book and every element and six for PVP.
Well yes, that is the game for people without any imagination or creativity.
The simple game of speed denial, hit and support has been gone since the introduction of generals three years ago. It became even less relevant when VIPS/Bulwark was introduced, when the lab came around, artifacts became more commonly available, resurrection was not just limited to Uriel, relics were introduced, chain denial was nerfed, et cetera.
I could mention a lot of things SP did not get right recently or in the past, but in general the game has become far more interesting over the years. I hope SP will be able to continue making things more interesting for at least another few years.
I would love SP to explain how they think everyone will suddenly earn a whacking 1000 trophies more than last season, when leaving the trophy win/loss ratio intact.
Because realistically, it does not matter if my trophies go back to 4000 for the start of the season or stay at my previous 4171. It's difficult for me to progress beyond a certain number of trophies and if I drop too much I will also bounce back automatically on increased successful defences.
I am not being sarcastic here, I really want to know.
I just fear the answer will not be very good.
This system is extremely complex and delicate, it's not easy to apply big changes without risking to disrupt the entire system. For this reason, we want to be careful.
An entire League has disappeared. Another League is under big pressure.
The top 200-300 is obliterating the sub top and banishing them to Champions I. Seems to me things cannot get much worse than this.
May I suggest you re introduce the quadruple trophies from two seasons ago until this is sorted? Will actually reward players who play PVP, not the ones who sit behind their desk with their feet on the table and play 2 fights at the end of the season.
I can only comment from the end game perspective. Contrived has made some excellent points, I can only agree with.
I see lots of new and interesting monsters that give the game more depth and room for strategical thinking. All the Bodyguards, for example, are excellent monsters that lift the use of support monsters in wars. They are even easier to rank than the old generals when they return to the shop for 1100 coins, making their use more widespread.
At the same time however, the game knows some broken mechanisms SP is not fixing which makes all of this not very relevant. All Nemeses are borderline OP, but I would not have any problems with them if Samael did not exist as well, who simply is beyond broken. A game, or even one war, should never be about the use of only one monster. It is ridiculous that a team like Power of Fun loses with more than 100 coins difference because Revolution Valkyrie has more Samaels. It is ridiculous that the same team starts kicking players just because they do not own Samael (and what's next, kicking everyone who does not have 2 Samaels?). It is ridiculous that a team like Titans Resurrection suffers a perfect score defeat.
All of this said with much respect to my colleagues in RV, who are not only incredibly strong, but also know how to play and have a good strategy.
Even when there is no Samael there still is Demise who is nearly as deadly when she can be paired with Zyla or Voltaik. Obviously broken monsters, mechanisms or combos should be dealt with, in the interest of the longevity of the game. If Thorder's haste and slow can be nerfed, so can other broken mechanisms.
I do see that the game designers tried to break the dominance of Thetys, but they did that by introducing Nemeses. Monsters you can only buy with money to counter a monster you can get with war coins. So no, not really the answer.
In summary: I play the game because I like the use of different monster combinations, and interesting new mechanisms and combos. I do not play the game to think of how to counter one monster, or monster combination. Did the game become better? In potential most certainly. In practice not really.
For elite teams the buffed island is highly relevant. It used to be difficult to calculate how 'buffed' a monster was precisely, but fortunately that problem is solved by being able to scout the stats before attacking in Team Wars now.
Personally I would like to see more old monsters in the island, rather than simply adding all of the newest monsters. Buff all Halloween monsters during the Halloween season, all Christmas monsters during Christmas, all endangered species during World Day, et cetera. Could be fun, even if the buff only lasts 2-3 days.
Oh, and why not buff epics as well?
Often when people complain about reduced rewards SP points to the fact that they are still handing out more free stuff/gems than before.
However, that point is hardly valid when they also push the player's resources further and further. You have to have gems for monsters, you have to have gems for runes, you have to have gems for 17 copies of your monsters, you have to spend money if you want the strongest monsters in the game, and now you have to have gems for relics.
When you add a new feature you don't replace one reward with another, but you add ways to get rewards for this new feature. If people are enthusiastic about this new feature they will spend money to get the better stuff.
I don't know where ppl are getting this info from tbh. Taringa has virtually nothing about Nemesis dungeons.
This is just hilarious, really. You are getting first hand information on this Forum, but you doubt its reliability because it is not leaked on Taringa?
I must compliment SP on the new Teamshop Update. There are some excellent choices, except to those people who still think Thetys is the best monster ever (she maybe was 2 years ago, well no, not even then), or to self entitled spoiled elites who can only think of ranking the next Nemesis.
Shannara's Bodyguard: possibly the most overlooked, recent monster. He has the life of a Nemesis, hits very hard on metal (Talos), is immune to stun, can remove debuffs, has some stun denial himself and even can taunt if that s what you need. Oh, and a killer special. 950 coins is an insult to his class.
Ingvar's Bodyguard: Certainly not the best Bodyguard, but still a very decent Light choice. 1100 coins seems a bit overpriced compared to Shannara's BG.
Toy Master: This was one of Your Master's favourite monsters. A very versatile denier/disruptor from the badly covered Family Book. A pity about his useless trait, but certainly worth getting if you are lacking in this book. 1250 coins seems a fair price.
Ralbog: A half decent monster for Underworld and Evil Legions. Unfortunately he simply does not hit hard enough for modern standards, but he is difficult to ignore in battle when he can burn/bleed and shield himself. Same price as Toy Master.
Cyan Nathura: A nice monster from Superheroes. Heals, poisons, regenerates. If set up properly she can be really troublesome. A pity that with 1500 coins she seems a bit over priced (because of her gold production? Imo that really should not be a factor in determining the price)
Currently we are in a war with a team that seems a very good match for us. It probably is the best match we had in months. However, they still are at 0 coins because their entire team moved to a race team to get the nice and shiny monster.
Monster Legends should be mainly about Wars and PVP (and collecting for those who do not have enough of that in Dragon City). Obtaining a race monster should be a way to advance to do better in Wars and PVP. At the moment obtaining a race monster seems to be the primary goal of many teams. Even to the extend that what should be the ultimate goal, fighting a close war against an evenly matched team, is abandoned.
Once again, please try to stop this ridiculous race hopping.
To be honest, it is usually a bad idea to try to deny them in the first place.
Throwing poop and hope it sticks is usually not the best way to secure victory.
You don't say. News flash we don't all have your 130s and X strength and 1 shot kills. "Trying" to deny them is often our best shot.
Really. Rank 5 monster's life is relatively high compared to monsters at lower levels. Monsters at higher levels are usually also packed with diamond armour relics. One shotting monsters at lower levels should be easier.
Well, even though I do not necessarily disagree with that, I remember someone making a very emotional plea to change how a monster works that had been around for over a year already and which had been one of the favourite monsters to rank for F2P.
LOL. Still butt hurt over Darmith BG ? I have been away from the forum for how long now and still not over it? It is hilarious.
But ok let's go there.
That monster's move description did not meet what it does and other monsters who had same moves description and already in game did not do what he did. He was a violation of what already existed. On the other hand recently frozen and possessed do not even exist.
I never was hurt by Darmith's BG, which you would know if you had followed the same thread you started. I agreed with the 'nerf'.
The principle is the same though: people invested in this monster for a reason. SP employees apparently even had confirmed that that is how he should work. You saw no problem in changing how he functioned, because he was bothering you. Now that you think a change is not to your benefit however ... makes all your other arguments not so convincing.
That plea affected one monster who was illogically one shot hitting when he was meant as a support, this affects dozens of monsters ability to deny when they are meant as deniers.
That monster was in game for a year u say? This changes something that has been there since frozen and possessed were introduced. White walker, the first freezer was there since its debut. Possessed was there since Razfeesh was there. Not the same and u know it.
So after one year is OK, but after three years is not?
Yes it is a great for the top players with warmasters and vips and nemesis who barely get denied anyway, not so good for us middle level players who have invested gems and elementium, cells and war coins in monsters like Baba Yaga and Kihaku and Nishant pet.
i am surprised that someone with a self claimed great knowledge of the game has such a limited view on how to use those monsters. Maybe you should re examine their skills. Here's a start:
Baba Yaga: 'Yaga's Curse', 'Kid Eater', 'Rotten Blue Rose', 'Baba's Torment'.
Nishant's Pet: 'Nocturnal tackle', 'Infernal rabies' 'Gloomy Doom'.
Kihaku: 'Kiai', 'Kyodo', 'Mokuso', 'Katatedori'.
Oh thank u so much for listing the moves. Opening their wiki page was too tough.
Again Ekto if i was on untamable or amab with ur X health runes and nemesis and warmasters, i would not care much either. U dont even need deniers, ur wars are mostly based on health and outlasting.
You don't need to play the Nemesis card with me. I have 0 at rank 5. I have one warmaster at rank 1. My pvp team consists of this one warmaster, a breedable and a team shop monster. None of them have full X runes. Nothing there a player of your level could not have. Also, if you think denial plays no part at the higher levels then I wonder what all those Xirons and Thalassas are doing there currently.
Frostbite, Kihaku, Baba yaga, Caillech, Krampus, Nishant Pet whose main purpose is to be deniers effectively become a 1 turn use monster. Yes they have other moves but no one uses Baba Yaga for blue rose.
They have other excellent moves. You make it sound as if they have become utterly useless with this change, which is equally ridiculous. Free skill changing would be nice though, as is suggested earlier in this thread. And some other form of compensation as well.
I also see that a well known top 10 team, which I will call Orchestra of Annihilation since I cannot mention their real name, has gone to a Team Battlegrounds team. Fortunately their score isn't above 150.000 so they drop to tier 3. For a next edition however, if they have gained enough war coins, they probably will cross that barrier.
Apparently calling SP greedy is cool, but messing up the rankings, stomping on lower teams and stealing from them is not greedy at all.
It is not my custom to be unnecessarily negative, but why in the name of Barbatos's smelly butt fungus did anyone think it was a good idea to haste the release of Babari after the quite desastrous releases of Thalassa and especially Zahra?
Calm down, run more tests, think things through. It heavily and negatively impacts player's playing experience to have to deal with unbalanced and bugged monsters. Especially warmasters, since before you know it they will be everywhere.
The Warmasters are fine as they are, I think. Of course one is more powerful, or has a more obvious purpose than the other, but the same is true for VIPs and Nemeses.
Thalassa needs a nerf though, she just is a big fat joke and should be renamed 'Squid the Win Button'.
I must compliment SP on making this event, a nice change from the regular pace of wars. Although it would have been nice if they had rune experience at the same time. Epics who otherwise are discarded easily may now have a chance to shine.
Some excellent epics for these rules, just to list a few:
Nautilus: since he is still not fixed he can possibly wipe an entire team if he carries strength. And there are only a few freeze immune epics.
Ophiuchus: There are, I believe, no possess immune epics, and there is no bulwark or tough in play. So his 2 turn possession will almost be an instant match winner, unless he faces a team of three artifacts.
Volray: Perfectly capable of wiping out an entire enemy team with 'infinity voltage' if he is runed properly.
Sweeperion: He cannot be denied. He can remove any negative effects from his allies. Just pair him with a slower Ophiuchus, Nautilus or Volray, remove anything that hit them and you are done. Extra bonus: only gets critical from magic.
Avaast: He has a multi freeze. Very good for opening denial (though not against Ledo).
Ledovech: A freeze and stun machine (if you give him the right skills). Unfortunately no group denial.
Furrhem: A more versatile version of Ledovech. Immune to stun instead of freeze.
Dragonian Beast: He has an AOE stun. Which makes him a good candidate for any team in these rules. Unfortunately he has a very low natural speed.
Support and Disruption:
If you have any of the game winners you may not need any other support than a team speed slave, but:
Inknatius: He cannot be denied, he hits hard and he has a multi blind.
Wolff'tagnan: Double damage for the entire ally team and clearing debuffs is just very, very nasty. Only gets critical damage from one element.
Esthirel: Clear negative effects, burn, blind, give double damage, there is not much she cannot do.
Skeel Trooper: AOE burn, blind and poison. Give him 2 turns and the enemy will be wiped.
I-Pug: Hits hard, can poison, gives stamina leak. And a nasty special on defence, garantueed to take out one enemy,
From the reactions so far I can say that Team Wars is mostly fine as it is., except for the Match Making, which could still be improved. Many sensible suggestions have been made already over the past year, so I will not repeat that here.
On a regular basis however, Untamable is matched to teams that have members who all have 10 race monsters available, but not the runes, relics or experience that should come with this number of lvl 115 monsters. So bad match making is at least partly also caused by too many teams exploiting the mazes in the rules and jumping to race teams every race.
These are my current, although broad and generalised, thoughts about the relative value of the different types of Relics, all IMO and FWIW, which may assist others in deciding which to prioritise.
Excellent read and spot on as usual.
- Speed and Slow
It is hard to assess these, while the turn order recalculation mechanic is so flawed. At present, both of these categories are a lottery - they could mean you don't get another turn for a bit, whether or not they are supposed to benefit you. And that flaw is exacerbated because these perks last a turn or two and then values revert, putting you at the mercy of the broken turn recalculation twice.
The Machiavellian among us will see that these are potentially effective on defence, subjecting the attacker to the whims of the turn order algorithm. Whether that is appropriate use of these Relics (exploiting a known glitch) is a matter for debate.
As mister Worf would say: using speed/slow relics is not honourable.
'Space Time', 'Evasion' and 'Looped Damage' are good remedies against the speed/slow terror though.
I am sure anyone willingly exploiting this bug will point fingers at SP, since apparently it is OK to shift away any personal responsibility for fair play when you can blame someone else.
And as usual, I do not mind much if less advanced players use these things, since they are already facing higher level, stronger runed and stronger relicked cash monsters. on a regular basis. Still not nice, but understandable. When I see someone from the higher ranking teams using these things however ... I mean, seriously.
@Fox From comments on Facebook it appears that the extra elementium was taken, except from those who had already spent it ( not giving them a negative balance).
I hope this can be remedied, since it is is rewarding those who had no hesitation to quickly spend everything to make it harder to trace back.
It is difficult to maintain a higher moral stance on issues like these, when it clearly pays off to exploit whenever you can.
Anyone got against this disgusting cheese tact? Stack 6x level 30 pestilence traps to reduce opponent hp by 20-30k hp and use all team speed and speeed runes ftw..ABSOLUTELY GOVERMENT CHEESE. Please Socialpoint remove relic stacking to a certain degree.
It's a clever and cunning tactic really. And it cannot be done with triple Nemesis teams everyone always complains about.
I suppose you prefer to stamina devourer the enemy and sweep with Voltaik. Yes, very clever, and not cheesy at all.
What please is the purpose of reducing the precision for Voltaik's "Electrodynamic Assault" to 0 (zero)? SP, please!
Race team or not?
We lost many teammates in the current team race because we are facing Left hand of God(one of the teams that gem/skip nodes to win) and we cannot win the 1st place.
Many suggested to create a race team to get easy win but it won't be a fair play to others.
How you guys think about the Race teams?
Some teams created few race teams and they just abandon the team and hop to another race team once they found they are facing a strong opponent.
Increasingly in the minority as I may be: creating race teams to 'steal' the prize from other/lower teams is unfair and cheating the system.
Some say they only steal from 'inactive' teams, but seeing the screenshots of the race team hopping Apocalyptic Family Teams, it only rarely is the case they enter a race in which NO other team qualifies for the rewards.
Some say that everyone is doing it so they have to do it to 'keep up'. Well sorry, but just because my neighbour drives his car without a license, and my uncle evades taxes, does not mean I ever will do this as well to gain an 'advantage'.
Some say, SP is allowing this behaviour by not putting. a halt to race teams. Yes, they sort of are, still does not make it right.
I thought that maybe SP will be more willing to make actual changes to team races if I can make a case for their purse.
-We have smaller teams that lack the means to do many laps. Most likely they will get stuck at an epic breeding node before they reach lap 4. Will leave them out of this analysis.
We have mid range teams. Many of them jump to race teams. My low estimate is that about 2/3 of such teams do this, based on the number of teams that ‘disappeared’ from our race poule in the past few races.
We have elite teams. Many of them move to race teams as well (shame on you, you do not need it) . Only a few stay.
The very first races we had situations of teams doing over a 100 laps, competing against each other. Good business for SP. Increasingly however, this will not happen anymore, because players become more cunning in creating race teams. Not only do they move there when they think they cannot win the race of their actual team, they also move there when they think winning would cost them more than 14 laps.
This is illustrated best by some interesting behaviour I observed this race:
- People move even if they fear only very small resistance.
Our race poule was not difficult. Untamable usually does not win races. Equippe de Padawan Jedi Star can do quite a few laps, but nothing extraordinary in their log. One of the Apocalyptic teams was there, but they are champions at moving to easier grounds.
Despite this, OVER HALF of the teams moved, pretty much all of the mid ranged teams, without even looking at other team’s intentions. The only ‘serious’ teams that stayed were Untamable, Padawan and League of Extraordinary.
- People have multiple options to choose from. ONE RACE TEAM IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
On day 1 our poule was infested by an Elite Team that moved to their Race Team. Naturally, we assumed we would be robbed of our chance of getting 1st prize. However, apparently there was an EVEN EASIER place to go to, or they grew a conscience (or they feared we would shame them with our eloquence ;)), and they left again. Lucky us.
- Even teams that do not move to a race team benefit from race hoppers.
I am sure that many teams that left our poule would have been able to do more laps than we eventually did to win (33 laps). Lucky us, or something.
- People SPEND MORE if they think they have a chance at winning.
So Untamable had a fair chance at winning and we pushed on. Usually we know we cannot win and just concede to a 2nd, 3rd or 6th place. Some people who usually never spend gems to complete epic breedings, or who never go on pvp, now were willing to do so.
In the current situation (race teams allowed) SP hands out rank 3, B+ monsters for only a fraction of the cost of what they would be on sale, since most teams just look for an easy 14 laps victory. This is BAD FOR BUSINESS.
In the current situation (relatively bad prizes for 2nd place) teams that cannot win are not willing to spend much resources. They just give up at some point. This is BAD FOR BUSINESS.
So the best solution to make EXTRA PROFIT is not to make nodes more expensive, but would very simply be this:
Get rid of (part of) the competitive element and race poules. Teams just race for the monster and get it if they do a required number of laps. Let’s make that 30-40. It would still be less than the actual cost. Of course many players will scream hellfire and damnation at first, but I am confident that many of those teams will do those laps anyway, because by now they are addicted to winning races. The garantueed monster would be an EXTRA INCENTIVE for many to SPEND what they otherwise would not.
Extra prizes could always be handed out to a team ending up first (like extra cells), if you want to keep some level of competition.
And a very welcome economic side effect to all of this: VERY FEW people like Race Teams. Some hate them, others hate they feel they have to move to them. Getting rid of this practice will make the Community happier. And a HAPPY community is a SPENDING community.
There are no clear rules about this. Speed and team speed is an easy and 'safe' way to make a good rune combination for your team. Difficult to go wrong there. Leads of smaller teams often emphasise using speed, because at their level there are still too many players who just place runes without really knowing what they are doing.
More advanced players will often use more strength and also life runes. Depending on what they expect to face in battle.
Personally I often prefer to go second on attack, at least in wars, so I think of monster combinations, runes and relics that facilitate countering the most likely opening move from the opponent (which unfortunately was made quite a bit simpler thanks to SP's new ai). Sometimes this can lead to rune set ups that do not look logical at first. My Darkzgul at the moment still has team life, because I used him as a team life slave when attacking Voltaik bases with Faraday. Normally he would carry at least one strength and 2 speed or team speed runes.
Yes, the next one is progressive. Check our Instagram, we have promoted the new Monster there.
Team Battleground won't happen this week though, we had to postpone it.
Could we please keep the information in one place? Facebook was traditionally where news was published. I will never, ever start using Twitter, Instagram or whatever is "in" right now just because one game thinks it needs to be hip.
If you want to be hip you post it everywhere:
Facebook: for old people
Twitter: for old people who try to be hip
Instagram: for people who do not remember September 11
I know there was a topic about this before, but I cannot find it.
I also know this is mostly a problem of the higher regions of PVP, but still ...
I cannot finish 3 battles in PVP before my shield goes up again, whenever I come near the top 100-200. Sometimes I cannot even finish 2. I should not even try to change monsters or relics for different defences, because once I am done my shield will be up. I should not even think of the best strategy, because my shield will be up again. I should not dare taking longer than 2 rounds to kill the enemy, because otherwise ... my shield will be up. I don't want to be rewarded for killing triple Warmaster bases in a long and difficult battle by just having my shield up again. PVP should not be designed to cater to the fastest kills or slow-to-kill defences. No one is playing with life based strategies on attack now, which is a pity. This situation is even worse in L II. Cannot turn your behind before you are behind a shield again.
Please, give everyone at least 10 minutes to normally finish their attacks. Make PVP playable as it should be played, at all levels, with 3 undisturbed attacks and room for any kind of strategy.
Don't give me the Discord link @Marianne-van-Es, I want to be able to voice my concerns here as well.
edit: tagging @Carlos just in case.
The changes seem to be positive, although of course a lot will depend on the execution.
My biggest concern is the tougher restrictions for high level teams. I do not see why it is necessary to limit the number of monsters to be used in wars. If people choose not to use lvl 130 Nemesis, but a lvl 120 epic or lv 100 L instead then please let them? Let's not unnecesarily kill creativity here.
Sorry about Discord. devs are there because it's easier for them to respond in chat.
But I will try to answer you here as well.
Regarding the different restrictions for different leagues, I think C0ntr1v3d had the same concern, I will repeat one of our devs. The restrictions will be random but will have a different combination of rules (Ranks, Elements, Books). For example in higher leagues you can expect similar hardcore restrictions like in previous Battlegrounds, however, that doesn' mean that they cannot get easier restrictions since it's somewhat random.
I still don't think the SP staff gets the point. How is it EASIER to use an epic or a level 100 monster in a field that is full of lvl 130 VIPS, Nemeses and Warmasters. It's suicide if you don't know exactly what you are doing. Do my screenshots above look like it was easy to use those monsters on attack?
Easy = Use your fully ranked monsters
Difficult. = Think your way out of a situation with any monsters
Rank restrictions for wars make no sense, only limit player's creativity and if any of the devs played at a somewhat advanced level they would know this.
So let me bump this again.
The first books were introduced and half baked, empty books (like Families and Superheroes) were thrown into the rotation in Team Wars. People complained because they wanted some time to get ready and wanted wars with fuller books.
Winter Book was introduced and not put into rotation immediately, because people wanted to prepare. Fair enough. However, we do not need OVER A YEAR to prepare.
Villians and Adventurers books are introduced and, guess what, we get ONE DAY to prepare for a WHOLE WEEK with wars with them.
So can we please stop this illogical nonsense and have the Winter Book into regular war rules rotation?
I understand the reasoning behind the current smaller parameters of matchmaking. It is an improvement, in the sense that match ups have certainly been better lately. For us and a few other teams however, it also causes a big problem. It already destroyed Vortigern.
If we are not at 30 there are probably only 2 teams we can match, because only they are in our very limited range and have approximately the same number of players. If we go to 30 by adding weak/incompetent/inactive players we will probably lose because we will match a 30 people team of approximately the same strength that does not have these issues.
Recruiting during a Race is nearly impossible, especially if you are a team that is not very active during races because most of us think they are a stupid, irrelevant waste of our lives. We also lost a few players at the start of the Race, causing us to drop below 30 in the first place. So at the moment we basically cannot war, simply because we have to wait until this damned race ends and we can finally add some recruits who have a decent enough profile and know what they are doing.
I can treat races as something others may like for some strange reason, but I just do not do very actively. The moment you force people who play at a higher level to do at least 50 laps in a race because otherwise they cannot war, which is the case in the current situation, they may leave the game.
End this travesty and introduce some form of auto matching please.
@Carlos, target selection of the current ai is very dubious at best.
The old ai used to always:
- Make a kill when it could
- Prefer critical damage over weak damage or normal damage
Current ai does not do this, which is no improvement. What point is there putting a strength rune on my Shannara's Bodyguard (who only has magic attacks) when he keeps hitting Xiron instead of Timerion? Especially when Timerion only has a sliver of life left?
This entry if it is family friendly enough:
3 Years of Epic Monster Battles:
Thetys got caught in torment,
when she devourered Nishant’s breath;
but Atum stayed hard as a rock,
when he farted him to death.
Otherwise the censored version below:
3 Years of Epic Monster Battles:
Thetys got caught in torment,
when she devourered Nishant’s breath
but Atum stayed hard as a rock,
when he maced him to death.
If I were SP I would invite Sam to a meeting, because he is not an elite player, knows how to voice his opinion and often has a point.
To be fair though: two of the moderators of ML War Fighters have been in SP meetings as well. One of them is mid ranked, the other plays ID's in all levels of war. So SP does not only have contact with Elite Players.
It's difficult to represent everyone's interests. The document that was drawn up prior to this meeting was full of stuff I consider irrelevant or simply do not agree with, while I know others don't agree with the stuff I do agree with.
If anything there should be focus on the few things everyone can agree on:
- Ridiculous price increase in the Team Shop and no diversity in monsters
- Nothing breedable or otherwise 'easy' to rank in some books
- Forcing us to have wars with incomplete books
On topic. IMO Elite just means an endgame player, however they got there. A whale is someone in the top 10% of spenders. I would guess here, someone who spends $500 and up per month. Dolphins, probably $50-100 a month or so. Minnows, the occasional big gem pack.
I am elite Plankton.
It surprises me this thread has remained so silent. With so many people here who complain at everything that goes wrong, it would have been nice if more people shared in the positivity of this week.
So yes, a very good week. For me personally 350 gems from the PVP event, 300 from the Birthday Event, a good chance at getting 3 lvl X runes for free at the Cell Event (and 250 elementium if I wanted to). All of this gives lots of incentives to continue playing, after a period of quite deflating changes.
Of course how this is perceived will vary from individual to individual, but from what I have seen in chats and groups it gives mid range players the idea that they can continue their struggle to catch up with the higher level players. It also softens the feelings of the less well-to-do higher level players that the introduction of Book Restrictions and 'strange' rules like 'triple flame', 'triple water', 'double spirit' and especially wars with incomplete books put them back to where they started. The end game still changed (as it should), but this week's generosity gives people (at least some people) the idea that they are still involved in playing for this endgame.
I also want Female to represent ML babes, so remove Gretchen and Mommy. They may be "female" in the truest sense, but not really in the way gamers want to see it.
That reads on the sexist side, please tell me my caffeine hasn't kicked in, because as a female I find that a little offensive???
It is not caffeine deprivation. It is sexist and a very bad over generalisation of 'gamers'.